On Campus Podcast – Faculty Connections in Online Learning

Ed Butch: Welcome to On Campus with CITI program, the podcast where we explore the complexities of the campus experience with higher education experts and researchers. I’m your host, Ed Butch, and I’m thrilled to have you with us today. Before we get started, I want to quickly note that this podcast is for educational purposes only and is not designed to provide legal advice or guidance. In addition, the views expressed in this podcast are solely those of our guests. Today’s guest is Dr. Angela Bruch. Dr. Bruch is a senior research faculty member at Capella University and currently teaches solely in an online environment. Welcome to the podcast.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Thank you so much, Ed, it’s nice to be here.

Ed Butch: Wonderful. Great to have you. And today we want to discuss how faculty members can get out of their silos and build relationships with each other in an online environment. But before we get into that topic, can you tell our listeners a little bit more about yourself and your background?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Sure. I am one of those really fortunate people who’s had an opportunity to teach both in an in-person, bricks and mortar environment and in an online environment. And I really started my career determined to be in that bricks and mortar space. I got a PhD from DePaul University in IO Psychology and began teaching in business program and then in a site program and ultimately landed in the world of my online, which I never went against.

Ed Butch: So you mentioned that you’ve got your doctorate in industrial and organizational psychology, and I guess kind of keeping it a little bit more broad here at first, but does that background really help inform how you approach your professional roles and your teaching?

Dr. Angela Bruch: It does, and maybe I’ll just share kind of a funny little side story. When I was getting my PhD, it happened that my mom was an early adapter in the online teaching world and she taught online and kept saying to me, “The world of online education is like an organization all of its own. It’s not like anything you could imagine and you’ve got to do your dissertation on this.” And while I went into the slightly different direction, there is no doubt that the fodder for understanding organizational psychology through a very different lens really present in this online virtual world in which I work.

Ed Butch: That’s great that your mother was an early adopter and I guess maybe hearing some of those stories from her and then now that you’ve been in that online space for a while now, have you noticed a change in that online education landscape over the years?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Oh, absolutely. I think in the earliest years, online education was viewed really quite negatively. I think it was viewed as being easier or something that wasn’t as high a caliber learning experience for the students. And I think that image shifted dramatically. And while none of us of course would want a pandemic again, I think it opens our eyes to the incredible things that can happen when you are in that online environment, particularly from a learning standpoint. Learning doesn’t have to stop because you can’t be in person in class. So I think the reputation has shifted dramatically over the years, but I’m not sure that the substance and approach has necessarily changed all that much over time.

Ed Butch: While you and I were chatting previously, we talked about how there’s a lot of information and trainings for faculty members on how to teach online, but not necessarily a lot that are geared towards faculty and their relationships in that online environment, especially amongst each other. So what do you really mean when you talk about relationship building amongst faculty?

Dr. Angela Bruch: When I first started in the online environment, honestly, I had immediate regrets that I’d moved to the online forum because it was surprisingly lonely. And the term I kept thinking of was that I felt like I was in a little silo and I thought I would love it because I’m very introverted person by nature. I kind of really come off the charts on introversion. So I thought it would be a great fit, and I was stunned early on at how much I didn’t like that silo that I was living in. And I think in academia in general, there’s a competitive nature. We’re all sort of on a quest for tenure and promotion or SunCom living up in that chain, and we protect our intellectual capital with great care as we should. But I think that translated into this online environment where nobody really wanted to share their secrets.

They keep that information really tight. And I think in a response to that, as you say, we started to have organizations that focused on teaching online and how to really grow that skillset. But what was left to find was the faculty members sitting in that silo. So you create a great experience, you hope for the students in your class and still very solitary and there’s no water cooler or office hours where you drop by and shoot the breeze with someone. And so I think in my career I’ve really tried to figure out how to open that silo and create a nice Barney art I guess, where we could all hang out.

Ed Butch: You got to stick with that metaphor, right?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Metaphor.

Ed Butch: I mean, talking about those silos, I think that’s something that we hear a lot, especially in higher education, even at brick and mortar universities, that people tend to stay in those silos. When it comes to those relationships, what are some of the things that I guess that you would tell others in terms of trying to amplify those relationships and get out of those silos?

Dr. Angela Bruch: So a couple of things come to my mind as first steps that I took. And in all honesty, again, they were out of my comfort zone. And for many people, I think even teaching online is a little out of our comfort zone, but the very thing that I think makes online teaching effective, which is building a one-on-one relationship with the students in your class virtually, I think that has to happen with faculty. And so there are of course natural places like faculty meetings where you get to see your colleagues. And I started to really force myself to watch the comments in the chat and see who I was thinking, “I agree with that,” or “Oh, I need to know more about this or that tip they offered.” And so I began a real mission to reach out after a faculty meeting and tried to encourage myself to send a note after every single faculty meeting to at least one person saying how much I’d appreciated something, how something had resonated with me or I didn’t understand.

And I think that I began building this network of email pen pals as a starting point. And from that a few years ago, I proposed a more formal kind of mentoring system that we could use for new faculty, but for faculty were shifting roles or trying something different with a new class. And so I think that silly little note of just a sentence or two was such a great starting point, even though it felt really squishy to me at the beginning.

Ed Butch: Yeah, no, I love that. I think it’s a great way to reach out to our colleagues. And so you mentioned obviously a little bit more formal process with mentoring, and so obviously you see mentoring playing a role as a part of this. I guess can you expand a little bit more on that? What does that look like in terms of that process now?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Right. I have to say, I think the language of mentoring can feel a little funny. And so really we’ve moved away from that. I’ve moved away from that in my life. I don’t really use that language, but I’ll often if I see that there are a couple of new faculty members who’ve joined our team and I know somebody that would be a good connection point for them, I’ll try and set up a way for them to connect informally. And because so many faculty today, especially in the online world, are adjunct or part-time, their time is very precious.

So building in an additional bit of work is not necessarily going to be helpful for anybody. So creating a space where it’s desirable to connect, it’s transactional in a lot of ways because it’s helping you feel like you’re doing a better job teaching. I think that really leads to the deeper connections just personally where you can get a second opinion even on simple things like it’s a cheating case that I’m looking at. It feels funny, but I can’t put my finger on it. Having those partnerships of people that you come to know in your workplace more informally I think works better than those very formal sort of regimented kinds of things.

Ed Butch: Yeah, I think you hit on an interesting kind of point there, especially with both of us, obviously having worked in higher ed while you still working in higher ed. For some time, we see a lot of those part-timers, those adjuncts who are working at three or four, even five different universities throughout a single semester. And before you and I chatted, honestly, I hadn’t really even thought about that kind of that experience for them and what they’re seeing. But I guess, do you have any other kind of words of advice or pieces of advice for how those educators especially could really kind of get to know some of their other faculty members?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Sure. Another colleague and I, a few years ago set up an informal online happy hour. And it was a really strange experience in the early days because we hadn’t moved to this post COVID era of camera. So everything we did was just a call, a conference call. There were no visual cues. And so our first few, we was just voluntary. Anybody wanted to show up and have their glass of water for the evening or whenever it was they wanted to have. It was just a check-in time. And we found that it wasn’t super well attended. So we moved to virtual lunch hour, bring your lunch, eat your lunch. We’ll just talk about topics that are of interest. And what we noticed pretty quickly is people were more likely to talk about their dog and their children, their grandkids, the trip they’re taking. And I think that is where those friendships started to develop.

I like to thank that piece of advice my beloved mom gave me when I was a kid, we moved every year as I was growing up, and she would always say, “The first line in the development of a friendship is when someone says to you, me too.” And I think that’s how it developed. I think we started these lunch meetings where we were just checking in on the Me Too moments maybe in our work lives that we could all relate to, but I think it developed into more and deeper friendships. And I think the people who are intentional about being connected, I think it really works.

And I have dear friends at work who I’ll hear from maybe once a quarter or twice a year, and it almost always starts with what’s the new form for this whatever activity, right? What’s the new policy? But it does create an instant connection and all of a sudden in that little time, we all know we have each other, we can come on. And I like to think those friendships have really grown. So we started with the Me Too’s of working together and just like in any healthy workplace, some natural friendships start to develop. And I think that’s an incredible gift in the online world.

Ed Butch: Yeah, agreed. Agreed. And I think we always think about we have to talk about work, right? When we’re in those types of situations, but I love that you said that we talked about our dogs and our kids and all those things, and that is truly how when you think back to… I’m in a remote job right now as well as that’s how we made those connections is talking about those types of things and then the work just kind of sneaks its way in all the time as well.

Dr. Angela Bruch: It’s absolutely the truth. And I think it expands the potential for really deeper friendships with people you wouldn’t come into contact with. You were really place bound. You’re limited by who your colleagues are. And I had [inaudible 00:13:04] about this until just this moment when the pandemic hit, a dear colleague I’ve worked with for almost 15 years at that point, I happened to know she was a church organist and I was never ever going to be at her church in Kentucky. And when the pandemic hit, I reached out and I said, “Hey, are your services online?” And she said, “Yes.” I was like, “I’d love to hear you play the organ.” And it opened some new channels that we got to know each other in other ways.

And amongst my colleagues, we were routinely and to this very day, there are so many photos we send of the mug in your hand when you’re feeling crummy and sick, but you still work because online, right? And you’re the person in the foreground of your photo. And there’s a personal quality that I’m not sure would develop in the same way if we were in person. So I’ve come to see those relationships is much richer. And I think the challenge for people like me who’ve been around doing this for a long time is to watch who’s stuck in their silo and make sure they have an opportunity to get out if they want to or to know that there’s a world beyond their silo, just waiting to connect with them. I think that [inaudible 00:14:18].

Ed Butch: Yeah, that’s great. And I’m taking some mental notes here as well because this can apply to me and my remote work and a lot of others out there as well. And what we can be doing, because I’m an introvert as well, like you mentioned earlier and thinking that it was going to be all great and it’s like sometimes this can be a little bit lonely. And I think recognizing that and understanding that is one thing, but then what are some things that you can do? And I think these are some great tips that you’re giving here as well. So I’m always interested, technology is ever-changing, has been, right? And I’m sure you’ve seen a lot of changes over the years through online education, but as we’re moving into this realm of AI, right? That’s ruling all right now and that’s all anyone can talk about right now, how do you really see technology and the future of relationship building in an online environment?

Dr. Angela Bruch: I’ll say that what has stunned me in my online classes is the attendance at synchronous events. So I think students really want the flexibility of the online world doing their homework when they want to do it, taking a quiz when it’s convenient for them. There are a lot of beautiful things like that, but over and over again, the feedback that I get and of course evaluations is that people love the opportunity to interact in a more one-on-one sort of way. And I just don’t know that technology can ever quite overcome that basic need we have to connect as human beings. And I think that’s the same for faculty. I think it’s why our lunch towers that we connect virtually to eat together and the silly photos we send in group chat, I think those things are the essence of being human. And I think and subtractive as an online world is an AI and so many things.

I think setting aside the first blush of that crush maybe that you have with all that technology, we really want something that’s a little more permanent and real. So I guess I don’t worry a ton right now about AI in terms of sort of that teaching piece. Because I think as human beings we want that connection. That’s it. I think there’s such exciting stuff that’s coming down the pipe from AI. I think the ability for students to quiz themselves beyond the materials in a class or to really find ways to prep for things like the graduate record exam or other more institutionalized kinds of exams, I see such good things there that on demand quality. But I think that the basic learning process will still need to involve human beings. I hope so. I get they really hope that’s the case.

Ed Butch: Definitely. Yeah, I would agree. I would agree completely. And you mentioned obviously the synchronous aspect and things like that, and it’s not something I necessarily had thought about until you said that, but I guess do you see or have you noticed in terms of a lot of the faculty that you’re working with and part of this mentoring group that there’s a difference between those that are teaching in a synchronous versus an asynchronous classroom experience or online classroom experience?

Dr. Angela Bruch: It’s a good question. I think some of this is student driven. I think when a student intentionally wants to be in an online program or take an online course, it’s not the default, it’s not the I have no choice, that this is really my intention. I think the students bring a different kind of energy to the [inaudible 00:18:07] space and I really think the faculty do too, because everyone is engaged and wants to be there. And I think it makes for the faculty relationships across the university to be really strong ones in the long run. Because we have that shared experience. The difference I think remains when people teach in person solely and aren’t aware of the experience of online or vice versa. I have a number of colleagues who’ve never taught in person, and so they don’t have sort of that contrast effect. I think it’s easy to fall into a different kind of trap, a different maybe silo in that it’s hard to imagine that there’s a better way or a different way or that they both bring value to the proposition.

But I think the greatest difference to me honestly, having taught both in person and online is online work is harder. It more time-consuming. It feels more like almost one-to-one tutoring sometimes with each student in the class where you can in a synchronous environment give your lecture once, everybody hears it at the same time, gets to ask questions and hands them fielded together and hear others answers. And in the online space, you have to be so much more intentional about making sure that learners have the aha moment that you want to hit because you don’t have that more global shared experience. So I actually think it’s harder work as an instructor to teach online than it is to teach in an in-person environment. And I think the rewards are equally valuable.

Ed Butch: Yeah, yeah. And I think that’s important to really hit on. There’s absolute value in both those settings and everything. And I don’t think either one of them are ever going to go away, right? I think we’re seeing, especially kind of post pandemic and everything, there is a little bit more shift to some more online and things like that, but I don’t think that we’re ever going to get to the point where everything is fully going to be one way or the other, probably ever again. So there is definitely that value. And I think the importance of online, and you probably see this as well, reaching a lot of people that otherwise including the faculty that might not be able to have those opportunities as well.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Absolutely. You are so right. And I think about the ability to be a productive faculty member, well beyond maybe if you were in an in-person environment. I mentioned my mom and my mom much as it blows her mind and mind is an octogenarian and she is still teaching about a class a quarter online. It keeps her young and she has this wealth of knowledge that she brings from all of those years of teaching. And she is the first one who’s creating these collegial relationships with newcomers because she knows how lonely this space can be. And I think that’s an incredible gift too. We can feel in a culture that often is really ready for people to retire, we lose such valuable knowledge. And this online world I think creates a safer space for people to continue working if they’re sick, if they’re aging, if they have some life challenges, it really opens a door for a lot of flexibility and maybe a little more of our humanity to come through.

Ed Butch: Yeah, that’s a fantastic point. Again, not something that I would’ve necessarily thought about, especially if someone has to go and stand in a classroom for an hour, an hour and a half or whatever, this really gives them that opportunity that’s not needed in this type of environment. Even if you are teaching live, you’re still able to sit down at your computer and be able to do that.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Right. Yeah, it’s a good thing. It’s hard to see a downside other than maybe that loneliness piece. And if we all own our part of trying to help it not be so lonely, I think we can conquer that too.

Ed Butch: Definitely. Definitely. We need some more of those online happy hours and coffee hours and lunch hours and everything as well.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Right. Right. Absolutely.

Ed Butch: All right, so one of my last questions I guess I have for you is I always like to look forward when I’m talking with experts in their areas and everything like that. So do you see any kind of emerging trends or innovations that will help shape online education in general or really kind of this fostering of relationships amongst faculty?

Dr. Angela Bruch: Such a good question. I do think we’ve had a cultural shift and I think that it was a slow burn and it just really popped over the last few years. So I don’t think we’re putting this back in the box. I think that online life for students and for faculty, it is the new reality. And do I see that changing? I do. I think we’re going to have to be become even more savvy about how we deliver that online education that both my students use their phones for everything and finding a way to write a paper on your phone is going to be a challenge, right? So what can we do to make a teeny [inaudible 00:23:14] device allowed for productive work that’s meaningful that somebody can grade and give you feedback on? I think our next challenge is probably much more rooted in the technology, the hard technology that’s in a learner’s hand and a student’s hand.

But I think for faculty, the bigger challenge really will be to find a way to build synergy. I think team teaching is something that is likely to take off more and more in the future as people bring different skills. But I also think in terms of just representation, we have an opportunity to partner younger and older faculty, faculty from different backgrounds, different disciplines. And I think the student experience gross from that and I think it makes faculty better. So I think how we use our phones more effectively moving forward is going to be really important. And I think how we pair and partner the experts who are delivering the content, I think those are the really big growth areas that I would see or hope for in the future.

Ed Butch: And I love that idea of team teaching and kind of having those pairs of newer and more seasoned professionals, faculty members, and getting interdisciplinary. I come from an arts and sciences background and so I love that aspect of really getting interdisciplinary. So if that’s the way it goes, I am all for it.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Me too.

Ed Butch: So this has been fantastic, some really good information, some great things for myself and all of the listeners to really think about. But I guess I just want to give you a minute, any final thoughts that you have for our listeners today.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Well, Ed, I was thinking of something you just said, which is your world is not that different than mine, right? We have different job descriptions, but we’re both working in an environment where I think it’s really easy to feel isolated. And I think for those of us who are introverts, it’s really a challenge to reach out and connect with someone, but it’s also hard to wait for someone to do that for us. So I do think it’s a good reminder for me that even though I don’t always love it, it’s good to double down. Maybe I need to move to twice a week reaching out to try and build some of those relationships. So I appreciate you nudging back. Thank you.

Ed Butch: Of course. I’m going to put that on my to-do list for the week. I’m going to do one of those reach outs myself. All right, well that concludes our conversation for today. And once again, thank you Dr. Bruch for sharing your expertise with us.

Dr. Angela Bruch: Well, thank you so much and it’s always a lovely pleasure to visit with you. Have a great week.

Ed Butch: Thanks. You as well. I invite all of our listeners to visit citiprogram.org to learn more about our courses and webinars on research, ethics, compliance, and higher education. I look forward to bringing you more expert guests to discuss what’s happening on campus.